Two Rails, One Asset: What It Actually Takes to Move Real-World Value Across Chains

Hello. Hello, hello. Finally the music is off. Yes. Okay. I think it has to do with turn off with the sound or something like this. Would you do find something that is more, you know? Yeah, or maybe a better music. Yeah. Jack, how are you? Nice to have you here today. Doing great. Thank you so much for having me here. Absolutely. Our pleasure. But as a host, most of all, I think it disappeared. Okay. No worries. Just read from okay. Most of us here. Most of us can hear us. I think that technology has involved and involved so much. Still we have speaker issues even today. Are you guys able to hear me? Yes. We can hear you now. Loud and clear. Amazing. Amazing. Yeah, I was trying to speak but I guess there were issues. I was like, oh my god, here we go again. Right when it matters. But all right, let's kickstart this. The song was driving me crazy. I was like, how do we turn this off? Yeah. But anyway, welcome back everybody. Unfortunately, I wasn't here last time around. But today we have a special guest. Jack, thank you so much for joining us. Thank you so much for the invitation to be here. Very glad. Of course. So yeah, today's tone is set. The title says it all. But before I get into all of that, would love to hear more about you, Jack, would love you to introduce yourself. Tell us a bit about yourself. And then would love to hear from Rafael and David about what they've been cooking since the last month. And then would love to jump into the topics and see what's been going on. Amazing. Thank you, Mustafa, for the intro. So I'm Jack. I lead Steebokoins at ADI Chain. At ADI Chain, where we are building is a sovereign, a focused chain with the ADIs to be focused mainly on the Steebokoins and real world assets and bringing as many Steebokoins as we can to be completely interoperable between each other on ADI Chain and massively increase a TPS and the TAR cross-border and remittance sectors for the global south. Amazing. Thank you so much, Jack. Over to you, David and Rafael would love to hear what have you guys been up to since the last time you came on here. Thank you very much. Last time we missed you, by the way. I was the host. I'm not sure if I was a good host or not. It would be a lot of fun, but we still missed you. So I think a lot has been happening. And it's like I've been saying this for a few weeks and months now that I think we are in a period where I think the overall pricing of the crypto assets are way far behind than the substance and the fundamentals of what's happening. I've never seen so much excitement and so much institutional adoption and actual money being made. Then this before, it's just that the crypto market itself is yet to catch up. But we've seen again and again across crypto and in the initial market as well that these gaps don't last for too long. Again, not a financial advice, but yeah. I think we lost Raffa. Yes, I can hear you. Yeah, I was holding me, but yes. No, no, no, I think we lost him. He went into listener mode somehow. But I guess we let him finish off what he was saying when he's back. David, onto you, would love to hear what's been going on on your end. It's been a while since we've spoken, since we've caught up, so would love to hear. Along with everybody else, what's been going on? As Raffa said, we miss you. He did pretty well. But it's been a while, as you said. So there were many different things that we were cooking in our side during the last months. I fully agree with Raffa here that he's by far not representing the pricing in tokens. On things like that, not only in our side, I mean, it's almost in the whole ecosystem. By far, not representing what is happening behind the sense behind the doors by far. Many of the things we are still not able to disclose some of them. We just say that long time ago that we were only been disclosing things that they were already done. So we want to get rid of words and keep with the facts. But sometimes it's really difficult. Whenever you see something that is really coming and a lot of things done by the team, a lot of hard work for having really good things for the ecosystem to have done, sometimes it's really difficult to shut up and keep this until it's really finalized and launched to everyone basically. But yeah, tradition will be having really amazing things. But the good part is some of the things are already done. But I believe Raffa and part of the team to be disclosing some of the things. But yeah, we were not stopping by far. Exactly. I kind of love that. There's a lot of noise always around the ideas, always to build around the noise and then speak about it and come out with a louder voice than the noise around you. But no, thank you, David. Lovely to hear from you. Jack, I would love to bring it back to you. As you mentioned, you leave the stablecoin at ADI. Stablecoin is the most talked topic as of late. A lot going on with stablecoins. Stablecoins have also become extremely effective at moving money around, especially cross-border. So something that I want to touch up based on is, why do you see working capital, like what changes when they start being used to settle investments that finance actual businesses bring all these opportunities on chain? So we've been seeing that the increment of demand of getting financed on stablecoins is getting massively approved as a concept. Initially, the fintechs, the different merchant applications weren't super on getting stablecoins within their payment networks or at least within their financing. A strategy, and right now, AAC real-world assets are at least stablecoin, a valid system where they can generate a yield or at least get cheaper versions of the dollar. A different avenue and different way to get their finances and economies of financing done on the packet. So I believe that it's more of a new, a vertical for them, of trying to price what the dollar-weight average is for them and the financing costs is for them. And sometimes at the same time, that's directly democratizing the access to financing different companies. So if you or any average human being says, hey, I want to invest, you know, $1,000 in financing any SME, it will be impossible if you don't own a bank or don't own any financing company. But right now, through tokenization of these and financing through stablecoins, that's something that could be a done which it's an amazing new value proposition to the market. And we are seeing how companies are eager to start playing around these numbers and see how the cost of capital goes down by the incremental of supply on the market. Completely agree. It's been life-changing to see, you know, how many different companies actually from a day-to-day are accepting stablecoins, how many different things you can actually access in life now through stablecoins. So it's lovely to see the adoption and the growth. Rafi, are you back with us? Yes, I'm here, Sean. Okay, perfect. I have another question for you. Jack mentioned something about tokenization. So I kind of want to touch based on that, you know, I think for tokenization, the easiest or the natural starting point was Treasuries. Now we see, you know, receivables working capital, private credit as the next opportunity. And I believe you speak to us a lot about this. Why do you see those as the next opportunity? Give us some of your vision. Yeah, no, I think the use case of stablecoin will keep expanding, right? I mean, the more adoption comes, the more scalability comes in. We need to fundamentally understand that why is it better and why would it eventually go more while across specialty market? Because you see the possibility brings two things together. There is no enough shortage of money in the world by the way. Let's be very clear about it. The whole inflation and everything is because of the money supply, right? So there's enough money out there. It's just a problem of matching with the right opportunities, right? I mean, and the problem especially is that in the emerging markets, the emerging as well as developed markets, the right opportunities do not reach the right money as well. And this is where tokenization comes into play. Why do I think that the yield bearing and the relatively short tenure working capital and receivable financing and those great finance instruments will become the next big thing on the private credit side is very simple that most of the people, if you look at the Google Analytics results or any of those things, you will see that most of the people when it comes to investment and balancing their portfolio look for passive income, right? And passive income means that where they can park their money and they can earn a certain yield. Now, there is obviously a clientele effect in terms of someone understanding that, okay, you know, I'm not taking any risk at all. Pretty much. And I'm earning three and a half percent from the US Treasury's versus someone thinking, okay, I'm okay to take a certain risk of certain businesses or certain sectors. And then, you know, I make 9 percent and 10 percent. And I believe that there is a very large liquid available, you know, liquidity available, which is willing to take that risk. And this can actively become part of the portfolio because once the assets are tokenized and people are investing through that, that the composability angle comes into play. That it's not only just that I can take a position in a private credit on chain and I get yielding to it, but then when the token is composable, you can do lending borrowing against it. And you can like, loop it in the ways that are generally not known to defy. So I believe even today, by the way, you see, we need to understand is that blockchain was created for a certain purpose, right? And ultimately, the working capital and trade finance are the biggest markets, which are still run by the traditional money. So when the blockchain is reaching out, then the category been created when your big clear is like Morgan Stanley and Emmett Lene and fiddle D and BlackRock and all, when they're talking about it all or when they're talking about the on chain finance, that means that the category is already there. And by bringing those assets on chain, the private credit assets on chain, you are basically making the yield available to the people who generally do not have it. And then obviously, it reduces the cost of borrowing as well. When you are not, you do not have concentration risk and you are not dependent on a single source of liquidity. So if you add all of this, then you can merely see that, you know, with the global boundaries going away in a certain way, you know, the stable points and the magnitude of the credit market, which is in Trillians, it makes like a perfect match basically. Couldn't agree more. I think, you know, the compulsibility angle, especially to me is the most attractive of all. David, I come to you. I know you are a serial investor from the conversations we've had, you know, you look to always look for investment opportunities. A question for you. Now, let's